“There is a difference between obeying someone to earn their love or respect and obeying someone because you love them or respect them."
Hey All! Here's the cell notes from 30th Nov 2008! =) Haha, know this took a long time to "hatch", but well, here it is!! I have included some questions that I noted down during our GG that time. There were not much responses during that time and was somewhat left hanging, but still felt that it is good to put it here.. hee... food for thoughts? =)
Best regards,
Yi Xian
Message bible version of John 14:15-24, 23 “Loveless world is a sightless world...” Written by one theologen, but disagreed by many scholars.
Relationship between loving and obeying
Obedience is
· the proof of love.
· the response to love.
· FLG: “love and obedience are proportionally related” Which comes first, is like the chicken and egg?
· Obedience, by definition, is the act to obey or the willingness to obey. The more you love, you understand more why he love and then the more willing you will obey.
· FLG: “Keep his commandment is the basic act in response to love” So love comes first, and because you love him, you will obey.
Some people obey but don’t mean they love, just like they obeying societal expectations or for something that they are after.
Regarding Judas’s question about why the Lord do not intend to show himself to only his disciples, John 14, earlier, he healed and preached to the people so he has shown physically to other people. Probably Judas is asking regarding the spiritual aspect, what is the contrasting part of revealing this to the disciples and the world?
Paul: Is seems that in that he will send the Holy Spirit when he is away, but it is impossible for him to show to the rest, and that he is facing crucifixion. It is like how he commissioned his disciple to preach the gospel. It is the Holy Spirit that he decided to reveal to the world.
Physically, he may not be able to guide them, but the Holy Spirit will remain to help and guide them and to connect them with God. They will continue to work inwardly in them to help them. From scripture, Holy Spirit is supposed to reside in Man to guide and teaching you and tightening the mind with the knowledge of the word. It has the utmost knowledge of whatever that we lack. Verse 17: Everyone experience the works of the Holy Spirit in us. It is different from what Jesus used to do outside of us, that the world will believe through seeing. But his disciples possess the Holy Spirit to experience him from within.
The Holy Spirit is against the flesh and not the personal spirit. Paul, your mind is to connect with the Holy Spirit, and the mind is trying to connect with the Holy Spirit and to obey the flesh, so it is in a constant war. So it is that we have to continue to renew our mind to obey the Holy Spirit. “So does the Holy Spirit replace the spirit man?” “What about the spirit of the flesh?”
Emma: In the past, others can only see Jesus is a physical form. However, now, He given everyone 100% attention and 100% help through the Holy Spirit, everyone of us, and it is a gift from Him.
Why do we so often disobey? Paul: The story that Ps. Matthew shared about the “coats”. People seem to be putting on different masks everyday in fear of rejection, in fear of pride, in fear of man rather than God. Reasons are probably due to our sinful nature, greed. Sometimes, we did not do to the full teaching of Christ. Sometimes, we are ignorant, or due to inconvenience or laziness or we did not see the importance of obeying him totally. 1 Samuel 15 v19. v72, obeying is more important, and rejected the word of God is as good as rebellion.
Emma: Burnt offering is to cleansing and asking for forgiveness. But people may become taking it for granted. However, God may be looking at the attitude for us in doing things.
Emma: What are some of the feelings that we have when we disobey god?
The Holy Spirit may trigger you off, so we may feel guilt. Holy Spirit vs our own conscious?
Emma: Would you condemn yourselves? Paul: would God want us to feel condemned?
Sarah: Whether Satan will use our fear and guilt to attack us? Emma: Rom 8 v1. From Peter’s story, when Jesus tell Peter, the guilt and condemnation when Peter seems to overwhelm Peter. However, all the 3 times that Peter betrays God, everytime God asked him for the 3 times, it is to cleanse him and break down the feeling of guilt.
Emma: Do you think it is your choice of what you feel, and to decide what you want to do after that?
1st is to bring your sins to light to God and only through that, a choice to move, so that you can be forgiven and freed from the guilty feeling. Sarah: If you think that your sin is so big that you cannot forgive yourself even after you repent to God, you seem that you are greater than God!
Paul: Can we “outsin” God’s forgiveness?
Paul: If children sin, how would parents feel?
Kenny: Psalms 30 v4-6: God will get angry but not overnight, but he will still love us.
Serene: Natural for children to feel guilty, not worthy of God’s love, but God is a gracious God, and knowing his character will help us truly repent and it should come with action and to depend on God’s strength to not do it again and be stronger in our walk with God.
Emma: God knows that based on our own strength, it’s difficult for us to overcome. But through his grace, we can do all things. Amen!
Sarah: Knowing how much you are forgiven, the more you will learn to love. The more you sin, the more you will learn about the greatness of his forgiveness and love him more?
Paul: However, do not go into condemnation along the way, if not, you are taking things into your own hands and not trusting God and seeking God’s forgiveness.
Sarah: I really felt the peace of God throughout the Bangkok trip really.
Kenny: there are so many products of HP. And there are so many issues with HP products, but it still manages to arrive at the balance point/ target point. There are many issues with the line, overdrawing, and so on, but it still manage to go back to target point.
Emma: Work was terrible! Realising how others take your credit does not feel good. I’m glad that the Holy Spirit reminded me not to gossip and try to control and not to just walk off so that you don’t get into the mess which you will need to clear up later.
Sarah: It’s may be different to say just share, or to say bad things about the situation. Of course, choice of someone to confide to is also important.
“Ji jiao” boss, God created everyone differently. For some, they may seem over, but it is valuable in some sense, like delivering quality work.
Kenny: Jeremiah 29 v 11-14. Some encouragement.
Mark 14 v20.
1 Samuel 15 v74 – Linked to the fear of Man.
Get into groups of twos. Choose one statement below and finish it:
• Without the love & presence of God in my life, I would…..
· Not be who I am today
· Seek love in the wrong place
· Be nothing
· Be lost
· Sin more
· Not speak with boldness and security
· Be afraid
· Be very afraid
· Not have meaning in my life
• I do not sense God is present in me when…..
· I’m stubborn.
· We are suffering.
· I place other things as higher priority than God
· When I worry.
· When I’m angry.
· Lost faith in times of fear, worry, sickness, and becoming insensitive to God
· Walk away from God
·
• I am struggling to obey the teaching of Jesus because he is asking me to…
• I have renewed confidence in God’s presence in me because…
· He lives
· His grace is sufficient in me
· His strength is made perfect in my weakness
· Of the promise of the Holy Spirit
· Of His unfailing love
· He loves me
Love him and obey His commandments, from the project to reach out to make disciples.
Encourage each other to grow in our walk with God and in our knowledge of the word
Being more transparent with each other, being accountable and to encourage each other to obey.
Blog is helpful to incur spiritual growth, daily bread.
Meet more outside, other than Sundays.
Conclusion
Serene: Through our obedience, there will be more revelation of who God really is, and to allow knowledge to come into reality.
Emma: rewards of our obedience come from obeying commandments.
*FLG: From the LDR Guide
Relationship between loving and obeying
Obedience is
· the proof of love.
· the response to love.
· FLG: “love and obedience are proportionally related” Which comes first, is like the chicken and egg?
· Obedience, by definition, is the act to obey or the willingness to obey. The more you love, you understand more why he love and then the more willing you will obey.
· FLG: “Keep his commandment is the basic act in response to love” So love comes first, and because you love him, you will obey.
Some people obey but don’t mean they love, just like they obeying societal expectations or for something that they are after.
Regarding Judas’s question about why the Lord do not intend to show himself to only his disciples, John 14, earlier, he healed and preached to the people so he has shown physically to other people. Probably Judas is asking regarding the spiritual aspect, what is the contrasting part of revealing this to the disciples and the world?
Paul: Is seems that in that he will send the Holy Spirit when he is away, but it is impossible for him to show to the rest, and that he is facing crucifixion. It is like how he commissioned his disciple to preach the gospel. It is the Holy Spirit that he decided to reveal to the world.
Physically, he may not be able to guide them, but the Holy Spirit will remain to help and guide them and to connect them with God. They will continue to work inwardly in them to help them. From scripture, Holy Spirit is supposed to reside in Man to guide and teaching you and tightening the mind with the knowledge of the word. It has the utmost knowledge of whatever that we lack. Verse 17: Everyone experience the works of the Holy Spirit in us. It is different from what Jesus used to do outside of us, that the world will believe through seeing. But his disciples possess the Holy Spirit to experience him from within.
The Holy Spirit is against the flesh and not the personal spirit. Paul, your mind is to connect with the Holy Spirit, and the mind is trying to connect with the Holy Spirit and to obey the flesh, so it is in a constant war. So it is that we have to continue to renew our mind to obey the Holy Spirit. “So does the Holy Spirit replace the spirit man?” “What about the spirit of the flesh?”
Emma: In the past, others can only see Jesus is a physical form. However, now, He given everyone 100% attention and 100% help through the Holy Spirit, everyone of us, and it is a gift from Him.
Why do we so often disobey? Paul: The story that Ps. Matthew shared about the “coats”. People seem to be putting on different masks everyday in fear of rejection, in fear of pride, in fear of man rather than God. Reasons are probably due to our sinful nature, greed. Sometimes, we did not do to the full teaching of Christ. Sometimes, we are ignorant, or due to inconvenience or laziness or we did not see the importance of obeying him totally. 1 Samuel 15 v19. v72, obeying is more important, and rejected the word of God is as good as rebellion.
Emma: Burnt offering is to cleansing and asking for forgiveness. But people may become taking it for granted. However, God may be looking at the attitude for us in doing things.
Emma: What are some of the feelings that we have when we disobey god?
The Holy Spirit may trigger you off, so we may feel guilt. Holy Spirit vs our own conscious?
Emma: Would you condemn yourselves? Paul: would God want us to feel condemned?
Sarah: Whether Satan will use our fear and guilt to attack us? Emma: Rom 8 v1. From Peter’s story, when Jesus tell Peter, the guilt and condemnation when Peter seems to overwhelm Peter. However, all the 3 times that Peter betrays God, everytime God asked him for the 3 times, it is to cleanse him and break down the feeling of guilt.
Emma: Do you think it is your choice of what you feel, and to decide what you want to do after that?
1st is to bring your sins to light to God and only through that, a choice to move, so that you can be forgiven and freed from the guilty feeling. Sarah: If you think that your sin is so big that you cannot forgive yourself even after you repent to God, you seem that you are greater than God!
Paul: Can we “outsin” God’s forgiveness?
Paul: If children sin, how would parents feel?
Kenny: Psalms 30 v4-6: God will get angry but not overnight, but he will still love us.
Serene: Natural for children to feel guilty, not worthy of God’s love, but God is a gracious God, and knowing his character will help us truly repent and it should come with action and to depend on God’s strength to not do it again and be stronger in our walk with God.
Emma: God knows that based on our own strength, it’s difficult for us to overcome. But through his grace, we can do all things. Amen!
Sarah: Knowing how much you are forgiven, the more you will learn to love. The more you sin, the more you will learn about the greatness of his forgiveness and love him more?
Paul: However, do not go into condemnation along the way, if not, you are taking things into your own hands and not trusting God and seeking God’s forgiveness.
Sarah: I really felt the peace of God throughout the Bangkok trip really.
Kenny: there are so many products of HP. And there are so many issues with HP products, but it still manages to arrive at the balance point/ target point. There are many issues with the line, overdrawing, and so on, but it still manage to go back to target point.
Emma: Work was terrible! Realising how others take your credit does not feel good. I’m glad that the Holy Spirit reminded me not to gossip and try to control and not to just walk off so that you don’t get into the mess which you will need to clear up later.
Sarah: It’s may be different to say just share, or to say bad things about the situation. Of course, choice of someone to confide to is also important.
“Ji jiao” boss, God created everyone differently. For some, they may seem over, but it is valuable in some sense, like delivering quality work.
Kenny: Jeremiah 29 v 11-14. Some encouragement.
Mark 14 v20.
1 Samuel 15 v74 – Linked to the fear of Man.
Get into groups of twos. Choose one statement below and finish it:
• Without the love & presence of God in my life, I would…..
· Not be who I am today
· Seek love in the wrong place
· Be nothing
· Be lost
· Sin more
· Not speak with boldness and security
· Be afraid
· Be very afraid
· Not have meaning in my life
• I do not sense God is present in me when…..
· I’m stubborn.
· We are suffering.
· I place other things as higher priority than God
· When I worry.
· When I’m angry.
· Lost faith in times of fear, worry, sickness, and becoming insensitive to God
· Walk away from God
·
• I am struggling to obey the teaching of Jesus because he is asking me to…
• I have renewed confidence in God’s presence in me because…
· He lives
· His grace is sufficient in me
· His strength is made perfect in my weakness
· Of the promise of the Holy Spirit
· Of His unfailing love
· He loves me
Love him and obey His commandments, from the project to reach out to make disciples.
Encourage each other to grow in our walk with God and in our knowledge of the word
Being more transparent with each other, being accountable and to encourage each other to obey.
Blog is helpful to incur spiritual growth, daily bread.
Meet more outside, other than Sundays.
Conclusion
Serene: Through our obedience, there will be more revelation of who God really is, and to allow knowledge to come into reality.
Emma: rewards of our obedience come from obeying commandments.
*FLG: From the LDR Guide
